Understanding ERC-6551: NFTs as Wallets in Generative Art

[00:00:00]foreign [Music] hello everyone gmgm welcome back to another episode of overpriced jpegs it is time for your Friday recap episode we've got several Friends of the pod on the show today so first up we have zenica for our favorite recurring segment moment of zenica we have Gavin Purcell partner here at overpriced media fan favorite and later in the show I am going to be joined by Benny Yang who is a crypto OG he was on the cryptokitties team I get into his bio a little bit when he hops on but he is here to talk to us about erc6551 which is an advancement in nfts that I am incredibly excited about we talked about it a bit on the show last week but I am not technical so I bought bet brought Benny on to give us a better deeper sense of exactly what this is fun fact all of your nfts or essentially all of your nfts now have their own wallets this is something that already exists now many of us just didn't realize it myself included so Benny talks us through what that means how to find out out where your wallets are for your nfts and what this future might look like that's like the last 30 minutes of this episode I think you're really gonna like it even if you just want to skip ahead to that listen to it I think it's it's something that we should all be much more aware of and is really the future of the space okay um a couple other notes folks I am going to be in Miami on June 5th interviewing Avery akini and magscala they are two incredible women who are absolute leaders in web 3 and blockchain Technology generally mags runs double down which is a consumer web 3 VC fund Avery is the president of vayner3 so that'll be an amazing conversation that's on June 5th if you are an opj nft holder you can go to opjtour.com now and reserve your tickets we are also opening that up to the Friends holders and so be friends holders by the time you're listening to this you will also likely be able to go on to opjtour.com and reserve your receipts the friends holders will be able to do it starting Friday May 26th at 12 pm eastern time um okay and then with that we get in some fun topics today on the show pudgy Penguins pumping we have a good conversation around art blocks and the sotheby sale that just happened really diving into why fidenzas are such a Powerhouse why did it just get a million dollars at the Saturday sale I think you guys are gonna enjoy it but of course we do need to hear a word from our lovely lovely sponsors who make this show possible before we get into the rest of the show you all know I think one of the most powerful use cases for nfts are loyalty programs which is why I'm so excited about our latest partner Galaxy that's g-a-l-x-e Galaxy is a leading platform for building a web 3 Community it is a no code Plug and Play solution to create task-based campaigns and loyalty programs with over 67 million users galaxy has worked with folks like optimism polygon orbitrum and more than 2100 other partners with reward based loyalty programs of their own and I'm especially excited to announce their latest product offering Galaxy mint list mint list enables nft projects to issue allow lists based on different user profiles it's free to use and projects can then take advantage of Galaxy's other offerings like asking quest which incentivize audience growth and user retention in the long term go beyond the mint and keep using Galaxy's infrastructure to reward users through on and off chain actions Galaxy's goal is to help projects grow in an authentic way and help them retain their users and communities over the Long Haul and as a user you can start contributing to your favorite web3 communities today joining allow list through mint list and earning rewards nfts oats tokens and points go to galaxy.com right now that's g-a-l-x-e.com right now or click the link in the show notes to get started your web3 community is waiting I am so excited to announce that this year overpriced jpegs has partnered with openc the world's leading nft Marketplace built for everyone creators collectors noobs and experts alike I'm an openc user because they have the best selection of nfts and a truly inclusive view of the ecosystem supporting eight chains and eight Global languages I trust the systems they've put in place to keep the space safe like complement protection malicious URL detection and removal robust verification and more it's why they are the place to buy sell and create nfts that's right you know openc you use openc but did you know that openc now has drops new exclusive projects launch every week from Top projects and creators and you can check them out now using the link in the show notes they also recently introduced self-serve drops which is in beta and allows creators to launch their projects right on openc this drops product gives creators access to tools like Rich storytelling drop Pages multi-chain support and drop mechanic customization the full launch for self-serve drops is coming this spring so check out the upcoming drops on openc right now using the link in the show notes and own what moves you you'll also be supporting the show in the process we're gonna start where we over always start which is just like General Vibes check macro how we feeling things are like you know there's hope in the air folks how you guys doing generative out season pretty good man I'm good things are it's always generative art season in seneca's World which is very true but now now other people are seeing it yeah yeah yeah yeah but like the market is a bit bullish the the the the the art blocks bear markets just are so short relative to other bear markets like I guess it was a lot well I guess was it last summer when it was really pumping again I guess yeah oh a few months there were pfp markets have been down for like two years it feels like it's only been a year like last May last April pfps are going absolutely crazy that's true uh it's it's all wild I felt like things were still yeah go ahead no I mean I was going to say they sort of they don't work in step with each other so like pfps were going really well but our blocks was like in a bear market like early 2022 our blocks was kind of like really really and generate about in general was down and out and then they had like a moment later on it's like it's it's cyclical right where it's all an attention economy and the attention follows one it can't be on multiple things at once so it's either pfps or meme coins or generative art or Solana or Bitcoin nfts and like maybe there's like two of them but rarely is everything pumping at once and so at the moment it seems to be gen art and Bitcoin nfts are probably the two big ones yeah right now and then the other two I mean I guess opepp and falling in that art category and then only force is like and on the pfp side uh oh and Pudgies looking at all this um a couple other things uh what has me feeling bullish today folks the Pro Bowlers Association is issuing 300 000 League Awards as soul-bound nfts on Avalanche if that doesn't get your heart pumping and your bags tingling I don't know why Apple Lynch like that's such a weird thing to like pull out of the back back pocket like you know it's like Boulders always often go their own Direction but like what was it about avax that kind of brought them did you say Bowlers often go their own Direction individuals pro bowlers are gonna come at you I share this with the Zen before but my favorite clip ever is this pro bowler if you Google like best Pearl Boulder strike reaction it comes up it's a guy named Pete Weber and he's just incredible if you've seen this clip you know what I'm talking about they are Unique Individuals strike to climate a strike to claim it [Applause] [Music] are you kidding me that's right who Do You Think You Are I Am get it right I guess if you've decided to make your living through Bowling that does say something you've decided to not care what the rest of society feels or thinks about you yeah yeah exactly and so you've decided to choose Avalanche I don't know maybe they were paid I don't know I mean Ava's definitely I feel like it's coming up a little bit and I feel like all these you know chains that aren't ethereum will shell out money to get right to get feds onto there as a news story it's a good press release right and who wouldn't want to be associated with Bowlers right it brings a smile to my face just thinking about it um we also have as we've been talking about blur obviously being a dominant force in driving what the market is like over the past six months really uh we'll just mention here up top blend has added can pie pandas and redacted remilio romelia baby romilia right Familia but romilia is the Milady Milady adjacent yeah it's a Milady spin-off thing um and they added Pudgies who's having quite the the week so no real comments there we've obviously talked about blend but it's so funny we kind of saw the same Dynamics where it's like these products like pump a little bit and then drop it's like I guess it's like the Elon Musk thing it's like when Elon tweets about something people buy not because they think there's actually going to be some sort of sustained pump but they're hoping to time it just right to like just get the run up and then before it crosses I guess that's it I think we're I think we're kind of done with it I think that I saw a tweet yesterday I have camera from who it was but it was just like clearly pointing out it might have been um uh Sam it was yeah basically he's pointing out the fact that like yeah whatever whatever run up there is doesn't happen anymore like the run-up is like so short it's not even so timing and I think also the tricky thing is what's good about blend is that you're seeing it to be the I think there's less of a of a pump and a dump right now because people are kind of figuring out what's good and what's not there was an update to this Tuesday maybe you know this they just updated their loan their loan protocol in some form which I think makes it harder for you to take out uh um is there something about it that made it a slightly dip more difficult thing to kind of game the system and so I think they're just trying to see what the maturity of that thing looks like I think ultimately until we get to a much larger space in this world I don't know if it's going to have that big of an impact and right now it's just a news story when something else comes on it that's why on it yeah and they'll end up onboarding most things like you know I I mention it because I do think that it's good to be tracking this stuff and it's interesting and then blur we obviously need to be keeping a close tabs on because they are such a dominant force in the market and still you know making up a huge amount of market share are uh these like air Farm Traders I mean there was a couple cases you had um I think 150 170 mutants you had 350 Doodles and you had uh like 120 miladies or something get get dumped on Farmers this week so like some of this activity is certainly that oh it's gonna be one of those days folks my camera just cut out so again luckily most of you listen to this on audio but uh for those of you on video we're just gonna it's time for the another drinking game time for another round of will Carly's camera last the full recap episode okay well so we've talked about art blocks a little bit oh there we go I think what we really need to talk about in the context of art blocks here is the Sotheby's auction of the three arrows capital let's back it out again um Sotheby's auctioned off a number of art blocks pieces held by three arrows capital is this a part of a liquidation is this part of like a bankruptcy proceed proceeding yeah and that's actually I think one of the reasons why we're seeing maybe Art nfts Pop a little bit more because I think one of the big things that came out of that is the the goose which is one of the most famous ringers was part of that collection which allows people to like kind of did you know that Carly the goose is yeah so it's part of that collection and then I think that what this does is just put this is 100 why art blocks is popping but is this part of a bankruptcy procedure for 3ac yeah so so okay uh people that I know have been tracking this for a while like there's they had a they had a really good collection right and so this is stuff's finally coming up to Market I think the other thing is people just forget in some ways I think there was a uh fidenza sale for like a million bucks right or something yeah that people value these things right and what in my mind part of what's going on is just like there's just a reminder of like oh yeah wait a second this stuff is actually valuable and then everybody goes back they're like oh a million dollars really I should do that and like it's just this dumb narrative ship like for so long people just forgot and guess what these are actually pieces of art that people will have real value and I think that's partly what's driving this kind of art movement right now I think it's totally what's driving our I think that it I think it is single-handedly what has driven this Resurgence in our blocks now we talked about it right our block comes back around regularly like it you know at any time I feel like the floor ends up higher and higher which is why I don't end up buying in because I'm like oh this still feels like a lot of money in a year that I'm getting married in a bear Market but I'm like which is what the squiggles were going for like 80 you know before I'm sure that they're up a little bit more now because a bunch of squiggles have sold but yeah something like that yeah I think it went up again yeah they went up that's right I figured the the fidenza is if it doesn't sold for for a million and and I think the auction overall generated like two and a half million so that one fidenza was almost half of this whole thing but you but you're right the goose went for a lot the Boost was the only one that went like way above historical Norms I think that's right it was an auto glass yeah well actually this goes into a question I have for Zen which I want to hear because there's this whole like narrative that I've been seeing about squiggles and glyphs versus have you been tracking this at all okay what is that what's going on there can you explain it I mean I think people look at uh squiggles and glyphs as I mean autoglyphs the first generative art on chain and squiggles obviously iconic for art block snow through borned a movement and like the narrative behind them both are they were the first there's a lot more cultural relevance in the minds of some people to what they did and how they moved the space forward whereas people look at ringers and fidenzas as you know just quote unquote just projects launched on Art blocks you know project I don't know what ringers was 10 or 15 and then fidenza maybe the 30th uh project out there and so people who seem to think that squiggles and auto glyphs are gonna have more cultural relevance long term are thinking that in 10 years time people will look back over the history of all the generative art released and they'll be like aesthetically things that are as equally appealing to them and the masses as fit ends as most people thought of forenses as the first like really incredible you know long-form gendered art project that looks like you know traditional art and uh people are like well now people are releasing lots of great art that looks really great and you know fidens aren't as special I think finances are as special and ringers are as special because just you know in part because of how great they are as collections but probably even more so because of how great Tyler and Dimitri are as people and and icons and ambassadors for generative art like they've been creating gen art for a very very long time and there's so many people in the space who like yes absolutely we wouldn't be where we are today if you know uh lava Labs hadn't launched um autoglyphs and if snowflake hadn't you know created art blocks with and launched squiggle but so many artists would not be in the space if it wasn't for Tyler or Dimitri as well so I think that they're very much in the same category and deserve to be thought like it's it's a really weird thing being like you know what's better or one or the other but I think like if we are sort of like bucketing them and maybe like um you know tears or whatever I I really think they're all sort of in the same sort of echelon that's interesting that makes sense you say you think they're on the same Echelon but affidenza goes for way more than a squiggle do you think like squiggles are are seriously undervalued I think squiggles are always undervalued but there's a supply thing there's ten times more squiggles in their evidences and I did see a couple tweets of people that are drawing this whole kind of like argument around uh uh which one is more real true crypto art or whatever that people were saying they believe in squiggles long term that ultimately they will be worth more than the fidenzas and ringers I don't know if that's true because of the supply thing no and I don't know enough about how art markets work but it feels like quality does matter to some extent you know what I mean like people if you look back like people look like the picassos or who I don't know insert here again I don't know enough about art history but like quality matters to an extent and I'm not saying that that squiggles aren't quality because I think they're actually visually cool but they're visually cool they're not like beautiful art I think by most people come for her Comfort they're gonna be squiggle stands no I agree I think that's even I love squiggles but do you think that's even controversial like sofra would say that sofa would say he he was more he's like more of an experimentalist you know who wanted to to have a case study a proof of something rather than fundamentally an artist Tyler Hobbs is fundamentally a generative artist and I I do think that distinction matters and and the thing that's so incredible about fedenza is is that you know art blocks other generative artists right you you produce a lot of works then you hand pick the ones you want to be a part of your collections Tyler was the first one who went into art blocks which doesn't let you do that right once it starts minting once the algorithm is locked in it's locked in and people are now minting and you're gonna get what you're gonna get and so I I forget how big the collection size is right but like is it ten thousand uh uh I think It ultimately but a thousand pieces that are all so unique looking yet all look like a fidenza yet are all very high quality yeah and there are fundamentals there it was the first uh as far as I am aware of like that and so I don't know I don't know that I buy that squiggles will be worth more than fidensis and I love squiggles and I would love to own a squiggle but yeah it's really hot I mean no one has a crystal ball no one can know I agree like what Tyler did is it's it's like really just pivotal in the the movement of generative art and you know there are amazing collections of gen art on Art blocks prior to fidenzo Ringers being one of the primaries but many others um subscapes by Matt delore is also really fantastic but to do 900 like that is exactly like you say they they all look incredible they're all unique in yet you can tell they're all part of the same collection and they just they look good in different sizes and in different situations and they have so they use so many different colors it like it there's just so many ways where like it could have gone wrong like that's the thing that's amazing you have to nail it so perfectly so that with all the kind of diverse elements that you're introducing in you didn't get just one that looks like a complete you know what I mean that's what I'm like oh this is obviously like the worst one you know it's it's amazing there was I think it was uh Dimitri who said this I don't know where he said it but he said um in a long form collection of you know 500 000 it's sort of it's acceptable to have sort of one dud it's like okay if you get one in there that just doesn't come out right that's like but true is unacceptable and like I thought that was an interesting out of 500 000. no out of 500 or a thousand like if you run like a scale a clutch on top looks it's like okay you can have one that's like okay that just came out weird but if it's two or more it's like okay the algorithm you should have tweaked more you should have bug fix you should have spent and I feel like fidenzas has zero and there are a few collections that have and it's just like yeah it's really really difficult to do that and also um when they were released you know now we see collections of a thousand on Art blocks all the time like they became the standard but before fidenza you know a lot of the time you were seeing collections of 400 or 500 so to release a thousand that would just it was just really impactful yeah and that's why there's no doubt that this will come to be understood broadly as art because there is such a skill and a craft to this and like the best of the best will produce a thousand and there won't be a single bad one and that is very hard to do okay I have one last question about this and this is an interesting just maybe what is our question which is never the most exciting thing to dive into but like when you have a thousand of these things and I by the way I think fidenzas and ringers are both incredible pieces of especially generative art and it's really something interesting but you know it's funny when you compare it to like what they would talk about the like a bingo or a Picasso right there's somebody they Picasso did not make a thousand of one thing that were variations of them and it's an interesting thing to think about when you talk about Supply in Art Market right when you have these kind of van Gogh's whatever are that are going for 30 million dollars and people are like well of course the fidenzas will go for 30 million dollars at some point too it is a slightly different thing right because you have a thousand or 999 of one particular thing and that artist is going to continue to make art over time so it's it's another kind of question around like yes gender of art is going to be incredibly valuable but I'm also wondering like you know the one-of-one artist like we think of somebody like x copy um who's making really incredible one-on-one art like that stuff also sometimes feels like it could have a larger bigger impact on the overall market and I think those are the things to think about too not to say that like these other things are great but it also has to do with supplier actually I think it would be really interesting to talk to somebody in depth about like generative Art Plus Supply and how all that kind of affects the regular Art Market I think that could be an interesting interview it's something I want to riff off on that I think that the interesting thing is like it's new like there's we can look at traditional art and and try and compare it to like prolific artists who created like a Picasso Van Gogh they both created a lot of work but like you said it was all one of one and sometimes it was like the same sort of subject matter that you know sunflowers or Haystacks or this that or the other but it was still one of ones generative art is it's just new and so we can't really understand and I definitely and there's also like the network effects where you have you know as like 51 of ones you have 50 collectors and that's just generally going to get less mind space than you have thousands of people who are squiggle holders now people are on Twitter some people have it as a pfp some people are literally in the email signatures using a squiggle you know uh snowfall is carrying around like a Polaroid thing in his backpack and printing out squiggles and signing them for people it's it's like a movement it's very it's just different and so it's hard to say I agree it's it's a I would love to like listen into a conversation from some expert on the supply Dynamics because it's it's really fascinating and it's hard to know what is quote-unquote better but I don't necessarily think that more is worse okay uh Oni I'm gonna I'm just gonna I'm gonna Speed Run us through a couple things only one force pumping pretty big this week uh they have announced they're they're partnered with Horizon Labs which has worked with ape down quite a bit and they put out a couple of different things like they've got this franchise model I guess now or that they've got resources now available where if you own and only one force they will like help support you in building up a business or something around your only one force um just a couple things like that where they made some announcements really to support their holders and they've announced that they have this like come back happening go ahead gav yeah I'm surprised I was gonna say I'm surprised that this model which I kind of think of is almost like the incubator model hasn't happened or I know doodlebank kind of tried to do this as well too but it's true yeah yeah yeah but to me it's like why wouldn't you if you've got a if you've got a swathv which may or maybe you don't have or maybe you've been funded why not try to take and launch companies from within your company take a small piece of it and then like raise it up because if any of those succeed it's almost like the VC model right yeah if you're able to see 20 of the companies that are based on your IP and one of them works and it's a huge success like you've just helped your company a ton so like to me that's a model that could really work in this world and when you think about how the the idea of how Dows have been involved and how dow governance has been involved like this feels like I know nouns also tries this now Downs has had mixed success in this world but like the more you can actually seed real companies or people that are doing real stuff within your collection just gives you a chance to do it so I expect this model could take off the question is just who has the eat left to do it right and this is this is the big question is people have survived long enough through this time a lot of people as as Kevin mentioned in the interview with Kevin and Frank and Carly you know there's a lot of collections who are starting to feel like they're they're getting tight on funding and that's pretty brutal right because there's not very many options at that point you either sell or you wind down and it's not an easy thing yeah I totally agree I think it's an interesting model I mean we'll have to see how it plays out right like it's very hard to be a venture capitalist for a reason and most don't work so there is that element of like is this the right place to put our eth or you know do are we betting on ourselves as the central team perhaps right and that's I think probably the calculus that's getting made there but I agree with you I think it's I think it's interesting it's a no-brainer for a doodle Bank frankly it's probably a no-brainer for an only one that was kind of dead or you know that is is not the right word I mean they were whatever they were like they were still an ether so I think or have anything but like oh no I think they went lower the other half and he's maybe but point being just like they were you know they obviously were not super relevant in a day-to-day kind of conversation way and so this is a way to bring yourself back and with something like a doodle Bank where that money is supposed to be for the community anyways and you've earmarked it as such from the beginning I think it's a no-brainer okay in the spirit of speed running us through we also have oat Pepin uh pumping I mean you had three new all-time high sales I think you had one for 14 East one for or 15 one for 12 youth I mean we're talking like above 10 eat sales on this what was originally a free oh no not free but it was an open Edition that was not expensive um yeah and so that is amazing congratulations to everybody who got into opebbins early and you know it's classic Jack butcher he's doing fun fun things where you've got these tiers and you've got these 200 sets of 80 you know a piece and they're getting morphed into their like final Pepe forms and I go check out some of the looks of them I mean again it's just kind of classic Jack playing with metadata playing with gamification mechanisms I mean there's a whole component to this where um people who hold the O pepins it's like something like some percentage of everybody who holds needs to vote for this like change to occur for the change to occur I don't know if I'm describing this well but the point is there's a gamification piece to all of this in in a very jackultry way okay a couple other things you know what I'm gonna I'm gonna I'm gonna say this six five two nine uh it's it's season three of the meme cards six five two nine um uh released number 100 and then it turned out Zach xpt had written a whole thread about how that person was actually kind of a scammer and and 6529 you know reverted course and basically swapped the metadata for all of them for a six five two niner art piece of artwork but he did it really well I have to say he's got like a long thread he wrote about it he basically said like I will buy back anybody's card 100 if you don't want this I got double at Double the mint price you know like um so we had like a bid wall up basically for anybody to like sell into if they wanted to um if they wanted to get rid of their card 100 and um he donated all the proceeds to Zach PT or not even donated but he basically like any money all the money they had made off of it he gave to Zach xpt to like thank him for his work so I just I I really like the memes I had sold I had one Meme and I sold it which I don't necessarily regret because I was I'm not I was not gonna be able to keep up with this whole thing and like do it properly but honestly I freaking like them I really think it's a cool thing to collect it feels like classic trading cards in some ways and greatest question okay it really is it's great yes yeah that's my Ponzi yeah for sure let me introduce you to a brand new company that I could not be more excited about web 3 cents a web 3 analytics platform that combines on-chain data with social media insights to give you the deepest most meaningful intelligence into any nft Community I have tested other analytics platforms out there but web3 sense has the most comprehensive capabilities I've seen in the nft ecosystem they apply sophisticated data science to wallet histories to determine behavioral patterns and help shape Predictive Analytics in other words they can tell you which Twitter accounts are actually the influencers in your space and they can tell you what resonates most within a community by looking at what other communities token holders are involved in the number of use cases here is virtually unlimited so whether you're a Trader Creator institution brand agency I promise web 3 cents has data that you want to see with the deep and actionable insights that you need to build analyze grow start whatever you want to do within the nft space and in terms of building a business and a community now they are still in very early days so they're eager to connect with the community so if you're interested in learning more about what web3sense can do for you and your business and you should be go and fill out the very short form linked to in the show notes and someone from their team will reach out with more information and an opportunity for a product demo trust me you won't regret it pudgy penguins I so you know people probably know the story by now pudgy Penguins launched a physical collectible physical toy uh on Amazon they sold out 20 000 of them very quickly made half a million dollars um you know that is cool to be clear and uh hooray I think a lot of them were bought up by pudgy whales and by people in the community so I wanna that frankly of all the things that pudgy has done like everything I want to talk about right now I'm like okay cool they sold it out but we don't really have a sense of what like the broader Market appetite is for these Pudgies frankly because it was bought up by insiders what I do think is interesting is two things a the commercial they released which people have probably seen which was a kind of toy story-esque I really liked it it was incredibly well done it was incredibly professional and it shows that this is a team who can execute something very well um so I I love that and then the the second piece of this which is to me the bigger thing is what they're doing with pudgy worlds and the fact that basically they have created this online platform where you go you can get a soul-bound penguin and then when you buy the toy you can get these loot boxes basically within your pudgy world where you have your penguin and all of this is done without having to interact with crypto and then you can have your loot box and you can dress up your penguin and you can you know trade Etc I'm not doing the world's best job of I think painting this picture super well but I I it it very much feels like the future to me and um so that has struck me even more than selling out the twenty thousand uh yeah I was gonna say I so I have a couple questions and I've been pretty deep in that ecosystem for not that long maybe six months now but what's been really interesting to watch with this is I think Luca uh pudgie is the owner and team have done a decent job of like opening the door to a totally different kind of world around nfts and like this idea of onboarding we always talk about how do you onboard people how do you bring people into this space I think this is an interesting way and it's also it's two part one it's onboarding but also it's very cheap entry points right like and some people may not even know they're getting nft stuff but they can and then when they open the door to what that's what's possible they're suddenly they're like oh this is pretty cool oh this Jesus has real value to it oh and they start to kind of learn about this stuff now that I think the beauty of these that commercial is incredible obviously I saw a really great I want to shout out I think his name is Tecmo underscore Bo he's one of my friends who's a pudgy he he showed a picture of his daughter getting one of these toys and like just pure joy coming over her face and like that's such a cool experience to have um you know I think the question will become is like with collectible toys it's always that model of like there's the Funko Pop people and that's probably the people that will kind of like collect them for money but then there's also kids who just want to have toys and like that also goes to what I think Luca and Pudgies is doing he's just trying to mainstream the idea of this IP because when you see a kid actually really love this thing like that is like a thing that you don't see very often in nfts you don't see somebody grabbing like you know uh a PP Pepe and like saying my pee pee Pepe like that's just not the thing that happens so so it's cool to like see that kind of Real World Experience use of it too yeah like just after an at vikon there were like kids with big boxes like because I was selling the pudgy toys and like you just saw them in the wild and I think what they're doing is brilliant and I think a lot of it's sort of off the back of the strategy that they launched maybe a year ago or close to it with their Instagram where like their Instagram has hundreds of thousands of and also giphy they've just got Pudgies everywhere and probably I would say the vast majority of people who know about Pudgies do not know anything about nfts or crypto or blockchain they've just seen the IP seen these characters and like oh they're cute they're fun they're I love them and they'll send gifts to their friends and then there's literally no idea that there's an nft company and project behind it which is genius honestly one of the most interesting let's call it concerns or criticisms about this I would say and Pudgy World in particular is why make it an nft at all which I think when you start to talk about a custodial wallet Fiat on-ramping a soul-bound penguin token it is sort of like like you know like at what point and this is where for me there will be this shift at some point where because the ownership element of this and and to be clear like the loot can still be sold and transferred and all of that which is totally a thing that'll happen but like the interoperability piece which right now doesn't really matter because there aren't really enough like open worlds that you're moving in and out of as a character but like the feeling of the internet feeling more like the real world and like you can move through spaces with your characters and you can move your thing like it just feels like that will win and that is such an a ridiculous answer to somebody who's deeply skeptical of nfts right like I'm not going on some mainstream Tech podcast who thinks nfts are stupid and being like I just feel like that's gonna matter you know but like my question is here's what why are you not doing this and this is I've had this thought about myself a lot I think in some ways fear of their reaction to it because the reaction has been so strong I kind of agree with you a lot one of the things to point out what Frank said again in your interview was like and Frank by the way young people like Frank and Luca both two people that are in their early 20s that know this space well but also understand as they come up they grew up with digital collectibles in a significant way that a lot of people but older than that have and when you talk about like mainstream Tech podcasts like sometimes they're run by people in their late 20s in their 30s or even into their 40s and like these are people who see nfts as a kind of a one-off and I think the interesting thing about people who are like you know let's say 12 to 16 right now like these are people who like have felt this presence in their life whether or not they've been in it or not but they definitely understand that digital Collectibles are the thing that they signal with or that they use to do things with to them yes physical shoes are important but they're spending like 80 percent of their time on Digi in digital spaces so like what are the things you're going to signal with them there those are digital things and if you can own those things it's even better I feel like and you can the missing piece is like sure you can own something now within up the confines of a particular platform and so the psychological shift is feeling like I own it so totally that I can bring it anywhere I want and again that might that sounds so minor I feel like if you're not if you're on the outside who don't don't find any of this cool and to me it's like it's one of those things where it's just like look well time will tell right like time will tell if the feeling like I can own this the way I own something in the real world will end up mattering to somebody and I think it will so that would be my pushback but I do understand that especially given that the the penguin itself is soul-bound you know it's sort of like what then what becomes the what's the different you know and it's a custodial thing like what are we doing last story before we cut to my interview talking about eip6551 Mercedes-Benz is getting in the nft game and we are low on time so I'll I'll say quickly here there's not too much to say we don't haven't really launched anything yet I it does appear like they're doing this quite well so first of all their their team seems to all be fairly nft crypto native people if you go onto the website it's it's Mercedes-Benz next NXT and you can see that all of their the people leading this charge have nfts in their profile pictures and have ens domain games and also if you look at their ensno magnesium name wallets they like actually collect things right these weren't accounts that were set up two days ago in anticipation of this moment so I think that's really encouraging but the thing that I actually loved the most I thought was most interesting here is they've put out up front that they're basically like three kinds of projects they're going to engage in and I have them listed here they're taking this three-tiered approach where there's going to be core collection things which they're saying is like their team they're putting their name brand behind it it's going to build on one is going to build on the other and that is the core collection then they're gonna have these satellite collections which they describe as like maybe fun things they're playing around with experiments not core collection maybe they'll have a partner who's on with them but it's them kind of playing and experimenting and then they'll have these periphery collections which is where their core team is not really that involved it's maybe they've licensed out the Mercedes-Benz name maybe they've helped out a little bit but it's third parties who are doing them oh my gosh I love this first of all I think so many Native nft projects could take a note from this and set expectations up front for holders by having a class system of like I was thinking about you know the Spotify announcement that Moon birds made and we joked about this on stage when I was with Kevin and Frank which is that moonbirds was like Hey we've got these you can now access tokengated playlists by other Moon Birds on Spotify and everyone was really mad because they have this feeling of like I paid fifty thousand dollars to get a token gated playlist and so people were giving them crap for it right if that could be in like the satellite category of like hey look this is not like a core thing this is not like the thing we're expecting to make your collectible worth a million dollars but it's something we're playing around with that we think could have future benefits like that would be such a helpful framing for people in terms of how should I think about this announcement where does this belong is this core is the satellite is this periphery I'm like Mercedes has just come in and set up a schema that I think is better than what like any nft project has done well uh goes back to we've talked about B team versus a teams right like we've talked a lot about how sometimes I get disappointed that a lot of the people that are in the students crypto projects were B Team people that kind of got elevated suddenly to a team status because of what it was and how much these were worth with Mercedes you know we've seen Brands attempt this or not attempt this this is an example of what it seems like an A-Team brand if Mercedes is like worldwide brand but also like taking this space seriously and saying you know I would hope that there's a CMO somewhere in Mercedes who said okay guys this is an important thing to get right who are the people how do we do this that makes sense rather than just farming it off to some agency and saying okay we don't give a [ __ ] about this go make us money right this feels like the beginnings of Brands taking the space seriously and saying hey there's a world where we can build a fan base in this space that can expand outward and we want to do it right like I'm shocked at how good this is and I think again the one thing I said when I first saw this is like hey the brands are not going away there's more coming in so don't be too frightened by this space right now like there's oh there are opportunities and when you see a brand like Mercedes come in and take it this seriously you know that there's a lot of opportunity and potential here still it's exactly what Gavin said whereas like you can look at like almost the juxtaposition of the brands that came in because they thought they could make money and the ones that took their time and are taking it seriously and I would be really curious to know how long Mercedes has been like internally working on their web 3 strategy because yes you know it wouldn't surprise me if late 2021 or early 2022 when it was like Peak High they were like all right let's look into this but it's taken them this long to actually come to Market whereas you know we saw in late 2021 all of these random not not random even some large companies come out we're like oh we're doing an nft drop we're doing something and it was kind of cool to see them try and get their feet wet but clearly they were in over their heads they didn't know what they were doing and basically I don't think any like AAA um brand or company that came in in 2021 has like really stuck around and been successful this is kind of what success looks like might look like um and I think with the the different tiers and expectations I think that's like nft projects have had an expectation problem since day one and I think they're doing a really good job of sort of countering that now of course we say all this and probably they'll be like here's a core collection thing and people will be like it's not good enough you know like that should be a satellite collection you know or it'll come out and the cars will have like tires that go like upside down and they're like oops we messed up yes yeah exactly you know something devastating yeah yeah exactly but but no I mean in all seriousness I think this is a really interesting model and I will certainly be paying attention to Mercedes and now please enjoy my conversation with Benny Yang I hope I'm pronouncing that correctly uh who is a crypto OG he's been building since back in the crypto kitties days he's going to walk us through eip6551 Benny Yang welcome to overpriced jpegs hey Carly thanks for having me here really excited to be me I'm excited to have you for folks who aren't familiar with you well first of all I think I think Benny g-i-a-n-g is your handle on Twitter correct correct but your your name right now is like b g e r c what is it it's BG what I'm getting it wrong now it's BG erc6551 so it is erc6551 I've been screwing this up I keep screwing up ERC versus EIP so this is not just like a proposal this is a new token standard erc6551 yeah I mean these are all subtleties uh you know usually things start off as an EIP and then they progress to an ERC yes so you know they sometimes were used interchangeably sometimes in EIP gets passed quickly and then it's just referred as ERC or you know vice versa okay well I feel bad der then um and I I've been sometimes talking about this in the context of also 4337 which is that now a fully an ERC or an EIP yeah that's an ERC that passed to mainnet at Eve Denver that's right and that was the announcement that metallic made Dan so I've been calling both these eaps but they're actually more more involved than that well let me give your your background for folks real quickly here uh so anybody who doesn't maybe know you Benny he is the co-founder and partner at Future Primitives which is an on-chain uh maybe you describe it but it's like you know you're building on chain products and services is that fair yeah essentially we we launched startups you know projects Technologies for decentralized communities that are fully Unchained Great and you were on the founding team of cryptokitties you've got some fun pictures of the old crypto kitties team with our our friend of the Pod Max Lavelle in there and uh so you were early at in Dapper labs and people might know that crypto kitties is really what ushered in the ERC 721 standard after cryptokitties essentially broke ethereum back in 2017 so you have uh six seven years of experience working with different kinds of token standards and playing around with this Tech so okay break this down for us I did this on last week's pod but I would love to hear in your words how you describe what erc6551 is yeah erc6551 is in the most simplest form every single nft now has a wallet um never before has that been possible um only us as humans who could create a metamask or a rainbow wallet but now an nft has its own wallet or we call it a token Mount account uh and it can basically operate do transactions it could hold other assets it could participate in governance so it's giving properties to an nft that takes it way further along from where it is right now which is like in an overpriced JPEG that you you can trade buy sell trade but in the near future in nft you you could actually become it you can use it you can interact with it um right now when you go to any DAP in the ecosystem you connect as your wallet right you pick metamask or any other wallet but very soon you can connect as your nft and so you could go to uniswap go to openc go to a D5 protocol and connect is your cryptic Kitty or a cheese Wizard or a board ape and now you're like a Degen Trader as a board ape right so that's super awesome help me visualize this we're going to talk a little bit about the kinds of products that can be built on the back of this but help me visualize this so if I'm my me bit let's say my me bit well so here's one question can we can we retroactively attach these wallets to nfts that have been built as 721s yeah so oh wow five one is super awesome because as of last week every single nft on ethereum Main net basically got its own wallet most people actually don't know about it I think every nft that you have in your wallet has an address a token bound account uh and I actually sent you uh I sent you an nft inside of one of your nfts I tweeted it at you uh I missed that yeah it's it's all live would you send me anything good I sent you a Grimes open Edition I I'll take that I have actually met Grimes she's a lovely human um okay that's fun okay so and do you know which nft you sent it to of mine it doesn't matter okay so all so most nfts now have been assigned this wallet and actually have their own address how do I find out the address of my nfts yeah it's super easy uh there's two ways one is you go to tokenbound.org you could kind of think of that as a visual ether scan to check you know you connect your wallet and then see all your nfts and then it'll show you uh all each one's token Mount accounts secondly the I think the easiest way for me is on open C so I go to any nft or go to your own nfts and when you click into the nft you have like the URL right openc.io blah blah blah just replace openc.io with tokenbound.org for any openc nft and then it'll send you straight to tokenbound and show you the token tokenbound account address wow okay so tokenbound.org we'll we'll put that in the show notes for folks that they know that that's basically the the key phrase that they need to to go to to find this and so getting back to this original question so if you're saying I can log into uniswap now or anything that I would have maybe otherwise used my metamask wallet to log into to how can I do that now directly with my nft which is still held in a wallet correct yes so it's important to know that the nft still is owned by a wallet and that wallet could be a ledger it could be a metamask it could be a gnosis safe whatever wallet you decide to choose it's just that you have that wallet that owns an nft that has its own wallet I know it's kind of like wallet Inception it's meta exception yeah and actually you could go as deep as you want you could have an nft on an nft you know a thousand times it's a Russian nesting doll exactly so and you know people are thinking of really cool use cases around that like um you know now that you can it turns every nft into like a folder where you could put stuff inside of it people are getting really creative of like oh what if we we put like um and the important thing is you could put anything you could put eth usdc Pepe coins you could put um nfts in there you could put 1155 so you could put anything it basically is a wallet that can hold anything right so but it's so I'm still trying to understand this user experience of logging into uniswap with my meet-it yeah so this is still I think we're about a week or so out before we can do that uh you'd be doing you'd be using wallet connect so if you go to unit swap you click wallet connect generate the QR you copy that and then you go to tokenbound.org on the nft that you want to log in as and then you paste that in and then you're basically logged into uniswap or openc as your nft yeah not the smoothest yeah not the the easiest user experience let's call it yeah it's it's really I mean this proposal was launched in if Denver right so it's only been about three months ish um and there's already been nearly close to 500 developers in the we have a developer working group and actually today we have a we have a weekly developer call on Thursdays and so we have developers from the protocol team at Seaport um Zora you know gnosis uh collab land like pre much all the the biggest players are jumping on this call and and like asking questions or contributing but yeah you know it's it's still very new um and there's still a lot of UI things that we're working through um in terms of logging in as your your nft and I think maybe in a month or two uh it'll be it'll be it'll start to get to a point where it's really seamless and you could go to any dap and connect as your as your nft so while it feels cool to be like hey my mebit owns Pepe now what why do you see that as valuable beyond the novelty and the fun of it for those of us who are like weird and in this space yeah I think there's two threads here that are super important um one is you know being being in the nft space since the beginning it's been really interesting to see it kind of go through different cycles and right now nfts have kind of entered this hyper speculative um Zone where uh you know the blur effect where uh you know the artwork is less important the creators are less important creativity is less important it's about um you know buying up all the floor and lending it and all the kind of defyish things that really make the nfts more fungible uh but you know our standpoint is like we love nfts we think it should be about the art it should be about the creators and so what 6551 or tokenbound accounts do is actually gives strength to the end of T so that it has it actually becomes more non-fungible because now an nft can have its own transaction history before you you have your meta mask and you have your nfts and your meta mask is doing all the transactions right now your nfts can basically do all the transaction it has its own history and that should be accounted for when you're selling it right and if you have other things inside of it other assets it starts to change the value of it right it's not just the floor price and that's kind of like the bigger conversation of like hey nfts should be about like you know about shared experiences it should be about reputation it should be about experiences and friendships and relationships and art um and that's kind of one big thread uh that and it should be about your identity like this can now be your identity and have its own transaction history and oh this this me bit once owned a board ape maybe that makes it more valuable amongst other mebas I don't know that's really interesting the way you frame that I think was fascinating in terms of it sounds like almost a shot across the bow at blur you know who is financializing the market it how much is that being actively talked about among you or other developers who are building this is sort of like we gotta Rush this out because we need to counter what's happening in this space yeah I mean respect to all product Builders out there like I've been in the startup space for nearly eight nine years and like even before crypto and so like you know you know blur itself they've done a great job um they they did what they needed to do they found a niche and they doubled down or tripled down right but you know me come as Benny coming from like working with a team that coined 721 and nfts and crypto kitties um it just felt like it was a in some ways a digression of of like what we were supposed to do uh with nfts um so yeah I think like you know to each their own some people see you know coin like ERC 20s as a way to do meme coins some people see nfts as a way to like flip and trade these things in a in a hyper speculative environment but for us it's like you know there's a lot more you can do with nfts in the identity is important this is actually the first step like building block block which will open up an entire like stack of amazing things one such thing is very soon and you could you you you could use your nft to talk to other nfts uh using decentralized messaging so we've actually ran an experiment um with a company called tribes there's also xmtp and mailchim and we actually successfully I logged in as my Zuki and I sent a message to like a t-shirt nft using decentralized messaging and so right now you know if you're looking for somebody who has a clone X you have to find their Twitter get in their DMS or find their Discord you you have to kind of have this little dance but very soon you can just like hey I want to message one two three that clonex.heath just send a message and it's um on chain and where does that message show up for them they have to be logged into this like this particular app yeah there's probably going to be a client um you know this is really really early stuff that there's probably going to be a website you know tribes or something you you log in or you can go to you know zuki.com or something and then there's like a little chat thing on the bottom and you just talk to any azuki straight up on the azuki website as an example right um but once you have once an nft has its own ethereum identity which is a wallet then you could start doing then you can start chatting then you can start actually programming the nft to have to do on-chain actions uh it could be like performing me Mev or doing other things and then we kind of get in this territory where um you know I've been talking about a lot on Twitter it's about this idea of NPCs right so in in games yeah then playable characters yeah right where they they're important otherwise you go into like Diablo and like there's no characters around right just animals and so NPCs have been really important in populating these empty worlds and in that same kind of thread um you know the way we see NPCs we actually call it networked playable characters and so what it does is it converts the nft now that has its own accounts and it can talk it could do actions on chain have its own like bank account and can vote on governance that when you pair that with AI um we think the nfts convert into what we the NPCs and they populate the empty worlds which we call right now metaverses or autonomous worlds right we all know with metaverses they're pretty much empty most of the time right and um we think that NFC nfts can actually fill that Gap and populate those worlds this is so exciting this is a [ __ ] that like I like you know what I mean and it's been such a it just feels like it's been such a dark time and bags are down and people are cynical but like these are the kinds of advancements that remind us why we believe in this Vision in my opinion and I'm sure it's going to be clunky for a long time so cause I'm like picturing like the messaging thing is so cool but I'm like oh God that's gonna be I don't need another messaging app like I don't need another thing I have to log into to get a message but I know we'll get to that point where like the idea that I just know your nft character and therefore I can send you a message directly via knowing that NFC character I mean as somebody who has an nft I would love I want to just message people directly through the nft I don't I don't like having a Discord like I don't want to have you know so I don't have a Discord so my head goes both places which is like oh God it's gonna be clunky for a while but also in a bigger picture way you just know that this is building towards something it's funny I said this earlier actually um in this episode which is we are still in that phase where it is hard to feel like you have a really strong argument against the cynics of the world right where it's like well why does that need to be an nft I was talking about this in the context of something that pudgy Penguins is doing and it's like I can't give you a satisfying answer if you don't believe in this Vision but like because it's cool that you own this thing and it's interoperable and you can take it anywhere and it mirrors the kind of ownership you can have in the real world like because that feels better than it being stuck on this platform than it being stuck in the Club Penguin game world without any ability to leave and with some of what you're saying here it's it's similarly like I don't know how to tell you if you're a skeptic I don't know how to tell you that this is cool but I can tell you it is and it's building towards something like is that how you feel or do you feel more articulate about it than I do no I I I feel the same excitement like um lately I just wake up and I'm like dude this is gonna change everything um it's I think the timing like if something like this came out I don't know three four years ago it wouldn't have it wouldn't have gotten enough steam or people wouldn't have cared because a lot of people at that time didn't even know what nfts were right um I think we're at this perfect timing where we had the explosion of the nfts uh in the last year or two and now we're hitting this curve where every all the blue chips and other everyone's kind of like figuring out like oh what are we actually about you know like what what like what else can we do with nfts and a lot of it or people what ends up happening is the top 10 Blue Chip projects who have the most money they can hire a development team they can write smart contracts and add utility for their collections right but what happens to like the the one you know single developer who's in the basement who's like I want to launch an nft but I I don't really know solidity and so their nft ends up being like very basic and like can't really do much it's just a picture while the top 10 start to get all the functionality and in some ways like the way we see 6551 are token bound account is it equalizes the the floor right it makes every nft have its uh its own address from crypto kitties to whatever it's launching next week uh and with that property now you can chat with every nft every nft can be programmed with AI um every nft can start to operate as like an agent on chain these nfts can pop populate these empty worlds and we get to a territory where we're moving way way way past by self-trade right um it goes goes into this territory as I've explained become use and interact and that's the whole point right um because if the topic is all about hey isn't nft just a JPEG that now you can buy sell trade then we're never going to get anywhere uh we have to kind of like craft this whole new mental shift of like nfcs or not even jpegs anymore right they're like I don't know they're like robots or something overpriced AI what is the spell that out for me a little bit more when you say it it can be programmed with AI how does adding a wallet to an nft allow it to be programmed with AI and what does that even mean yeah that's a good question so I think there's two ways to apply AI here right um one is a more simpler one is a an NFC can have a Twitter account and like [ __ ] post or whatever right like uh using the AI to absorb data and information and then output tweets right so that that's more like the social side the second side is I think we all know that there are bots on the blockchain right Bots that form different actions spots on the blockchain yeah yeah but these Bots perform different actions Arbitrage you know all that type of stuff and so I think you know the way I see bots is it's a program or or an algorithm that's performing an action that usually is to make money um if you pair that along with an nft that has a visual component um and has its own wallet I mean that means that the nft you can set it Loose right you could you know feel it with 10 each and then let that and then Define the the job or the task of this nft or NPC and then be like okay your job as a dead fellas um as my dead fellas is to go and extract Mev and then I'll program that using Ai and then every time you you win like a searching uh you you're able to acquire a capital through Mev uh you can [ __ ] post on Twitter and be like I beat you all right as the dead fellas right so that's kind of like the early building blocks but I'm sure there'll be a lot more programming that will happen where people can like you know like zapier like click on a few things and add um properties to the nft okay final question so the example I gave last week actually no I've got two more questions I apologize the the example I gave last week that fell obvious or interesting was like okay you're a gaming character and now you're collecting wearables you're collecting things as you play a game and those are now accruing to your wallet and now you can bundle sell that nft with all of its wearables and loot that it's collected in this game it feels like a very clear-cut useful that will happen example do you have another one or do you have a preferred example of how you see these wallets being used in the future yeah there's there's a lot and I'll give you I'll give you three that are really good um so the first one is actually one that we're we're building it's called sapiens it's a project with Jeff staple and it's all about the idea of a a pfp uh character that can change outfits as many times as you want during the day so it's related to digital fashion so instead of you know as a game character searching for items it's more about hey I want to like swap clothes and do it on chain and gas lists and I want to change clothes 10 times a day and not pay gas and if there's like a brand collab I'll Flex it right so that's one big one that we're seeing a lot of people centering around number two is Dow memberships so you've probably seen FWB or other dials launch a like a membership card and what 6551 does is now the dial membership card has its own wallet radar account and when you participate in the Dow on chain or off chain actions right now you may get some soul bound tokens to your wallet or co-ops or whatever but they're all tied to your wallet and so when you sell the membership card it creates this like separation of the asset so now what we're what we're seeing from a lot of the people who are in the working group is a dial membership nft and all the po-ops all the sold bound tokens the reputation sits inside of the membership card and then you could even update the artwork or evolve it um to show like hey Carly has a golden membership card because she's really committed and engaged right um and then number three is something that we saw recently from the working group uh it's called sofa mod uh it's actually really interesting it's you know clippy uh way back in the day yes the paper clip yes from was it PowerPoint or something yes yeah yeah like uh all the Microsoft Office so someone built a Chrome extension called sophomon where it would put a little cute bunny on the bottom right of your screen and that bunny is the your your NPC right and you could you could kind of play with it and it has its own wallet and you know it goes with you and all the different websites um like clippy and you could like you could get it to to basically transact and and do things on different daps and so that to me you know is like the you know I've always thought meta verses were a little bit odd like we're like oh we're gonna see this future where we're all just gonna sit and with our goggles um but really I think this is like a real a reality that is you know super fascinating we have our cute little nft character that's on the corner and it's like interacting with us and you know we send it on little quests so you know those are kind of the the three things that we're seeing pop up uh and there's a lot more definitely in the working group as well I love it okay my actual last question has to do with how you see this interacting with erc4337 God these I know let's just name it like you know let's name it Eloise or something yeah something that's easier um and and as a refresher for folks and I don't even think I'm we'll have to copy back on to do a whole just Deep dive on ear three four three three seven like you know my understanding of it is it it enables things like uh you know subscriptions and somebody else can pay the gas for you if you're a brand and you want to do a gas-free mint you can you know say we'll we'll cover the gas and and not something that's enabled by 4337 or um bundling also so talk to me about how you see these two interacting with each other or bolstering each other that's a good question so I'll clarify a few things some people think erc6551 is a token standard it's not a token standard like 721 erc20 ERC 1155 those are token standards that is quite confusing yeah I know why okay continue yeah so like see it's just any proposal and sometimes these proposals are token based some of them but the proposal should be an EIP then because that's a proposed the P stands for proposal yeah yeah well right ethereum Improvement proposal yeah well either EAP or ERC they can be applied to different like categories it could be token standard it could be you know whatever and so people are thinking like some people are like well oh I guess I decide to launch a 721 nft or 6551 nft or whatever but it's not it's not a nft it's just very helpful to understand I know it's kind of like a confused they should probably like have different like naming conventions for like oh this is a token standard this is like let's just say marketers have not been in the driving force behind a theory which thank God but it does show up every so wait till we reach six digit numbers so I don't know how that's gonna work ERC 100 056 you know whatever uh that's going to be insane um so yeah they definitely need maybe they need some help from from you and your community Amanda cassett is is our hero she's the one that hold on before it as the Ethereal marketer uh trying to to whack em all these problems okay but continue this is important so tell me how these two ercs that are not token standards interact so yeah erc4337 the the word that people just use is just account abstraction and then the 6551 the word we would use is token accounts so uh the best way to think about how they work together is we actually gave every nft a 4337 wallet or account so um you know so that's essentially what everyone has yeah I think I just had an aha moment but now I'm I I'm trying to decide if I did the idea with account abstraction and the reason it is felt powerful to me and but maybe I'm misinterpreting what that means within the context of 4337 is right now I have this problem which is like as I've accrued more nfts I've wanted to use my wallet less and I would like to live in a world where our wallets dictate a lot of what we do online I know I get into this website and I get into the VIP section of the website with my wallet but I don't want to connect my wallet to damn anything because I'm always so freaking afraid that something's gonna go wrong and I'm gonna get hacked and I'm gonna get my stuff stolen from me so account abstraction felt like this powerful way to potentially like access websites and things but keeping my assets protected is that a valid way to think about it and does 4337 have anything to do with that yes so the I would rewind so in the space of the last six seven eight years we've all been using public private key uh wallets right you got to save your seed words all these things that's what we call a eoa wallet right um and so that's what everyone's been using and we all know the onboarding problems and the challenges and the safety things right you lose your keys blah blah blah um uh so eoa wallets is one category and then the other one now is account abstraction which is a the whole the whole mission of it is to get rid of public private Keys um because you know the whole mission of a A or um construction uh is to make onboarding so much more easier and make it and and the account is a lot more safer uh and not only that you can program it and then it also opens up potential of like subsidized gas through um uh you know bundlers and all that so its whole mission is through onboarding is to Target onboarding make it easier make it safer um and not subject the next 10 years of mainstream users to private public private key scene where you know all of that uh we'll we'll be like kind of like the old folks you know where uh it's like you know back in my day this is how I did email right like that's gonna be us like telling the Next Generation but they're going to be like oh yeah no I just went to the website and I click create an account and I got my wallet right so that's the whole mission of 4337 and the way to think about 6551 is it's like the diffusion between four through three seven and nfts together um that's kind of like the baby that is born is six five five one okay so I understand that I still think I need a better understanding of 4337 but that's not for this episode because we're already at 30 minutes Benny this was is awesome I really appreciate coming on I'm really serious I would like to have you back probably regularly because this is a side of nfts that is hard to understand by reading documents like I you know I do not have the brain that can like read the documentation on this stuff and be like oh yes let me let me summarize for the people and uh and you've done a really good job so I appreciate you being here and awesome we'd love to have you back thank you so much Carly uh happy to go come back and talk about all sorts of things nft so uh thanks again for having me [Music] thank you so much for watching this episode of overpriced jpegs if you liked this conversation if you liked this episode please go ahead and hit subscribe it helps me out it helps the show out and it means you will get alerts and updates when we post new content thanks again